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	<title>Comments on: Some musings on negative refraction</title>
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	<link>http://skullsinthestars.com/2009/07/04/some-musings-on-negative-refraction/</link>
	<description>The intersection of physics, optics, history and pulp fiction</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: yoron</title>
		<link>http://skullsinthestars.com/2009/07/04/some-musings-on-negative-refraction/#comment-5536</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[yoron]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Feb 2010 17:51:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skullsinthestars.com/?p=2114#comment-5536</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;ll check that one up.
Thanks.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ll check that one up.<br />
Thanks.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: skullsinthestars</title>
		<link>http://skullsinthestars.com/2009/07/04/some-musings-on-negative-refraction/#comment-5533</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[skullsinthestars]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Feb 2010 17:28:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skullsinthestars.com/?p=2114#comment-5533</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[First, the &#039;1 in 3&#039; was just some numbers for argument&#039;s sake: the actual probability of the outcomes depends on the behavior of the system.

The way to think about the wave behavior is that a wave is a large collection of photons, each of which travels through an optical system as a wave but interacts with a detector as a particle.  Let&#039;s suppose you set up three detectors to measure whether a photon is transmitted, reflected, or turned into a plasmon.  If you send photons through the system one at a time, you will only detect each photon at one place.  When you combine the results from a large number of photons, however, the results build up a wave pattern.  I probably explain this more clearly in my post on &lt;a href=&quot;http://skullsinthestars.com/2009/03/28/optics-basics-youngs-double-slit-experiment/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Young&#039;s experiment&lt;/a&gt;.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First, the &#8217;1 in 3&#8242; was just some numbers for argument&#8217;s sake: the actual probability of the outcomes depends on the behavior of the system.</p>
<p>The way to think about the wave behavior is that a wave is a large collection of photons, each of which travels through an optical system as a wave but interacts with a detector as a particle.  Let&#8217;s suppose you set up three detectors to measure whether a photon is transmitted, reflected, or turned into a plasmon.  If you send photons through the system one at a time, you will only detect each photon at one place.  When you combine the results from a large number of photons, however, the results build up a wave pattern.  I probably explain this more clearly in my post on <a href="http://skullsinthestars.com/2009/03/28/optics-basics-youngs-double-slit-experiment/" rel="nofollow">Young&#8217;s experiment</a>.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: yoron</title>
		<link>http://skullsinthestars.com/2009/07/04/some-musings-on-negative-refraction/#comment-5517</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[yoron]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Feb 2010 23:37:27 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[One Q more.

From a particle view you will observe one chance in three for every measurement, using three &#039;observers&#039;?

But for a wave all three happens when measured?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One Q more.</p>
<p>From a particle view you will observe one chance in three for every measurement, using three &#8216;observers&#8217;?</p>
<p>But for a wave all three happens when measured?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: yoron</title>
		<link>http://skullsinthestars.com/2009/07/04/some-musings-on-negative-refraction/#comment-5516</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[yoron]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Feb 2010 23:31:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skullsinthestars.com/?p=2114#comment-5516</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks.
I&#039;m trying to integrate wavepackets in my conceptual thinking.
Every little thing helps here :)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks.<br />
I&#8217;m trying to integrate wavepackets in my conceptual thinking.<br />
Every little thing helps here <img src='http://s0.wp.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: skullsinthestars</title>
		<link>http://skullsinthestars.com/2009/07/04/some-musings-on-negative-refraction/#comment-5515</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[skullsinthestars]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Feb 2010 23:02:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skullsinthestars.com/?p=2114#comment-5515</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[From a wave point of view, the wave amplitude gets split into three parts: let&#039;s say, for argument, 1/3 into each component.  If we imagine a single photon hitting the surface, the wave of the single photon is interpreted as a probability density: when we actually perform a measurement of the photon&#039;s behavior, 1/3 of the time we&#039;ll find it was reflected, 1/3 transmitted, 1/3 plasmon.

(This is a little oversimplified, because the wave produces interference effects, but roughly captures the idea.)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From a wave point of view, the wave amplitude gets split into three parts: let&#8217;s say, for argument, 1/3 into each component.  If we imagine a single photon hitting the surface, the wave of the single photon is interpreted as a probability density: when we actually perform a measurement of the photon&#8217;s behavior, 1/3 of the time we&#8217;ll find it was reflected, 1/3 transmitted, 1/3 plasmon.</p>
<p>(This is a little oversimplified, because the wave produces interference effects, but roughly captures the idea.)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: yoron</title>
		<link>http://skullsinthestars.com/2009/07/04/some-musings-on-negative-refraction/#comment-5514</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[yoron]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Feb 2010 21:07:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skullsinthestars.com/?p=2114#comment-5514</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A really stupid question, just touching the photons here. When they, your &#039;ray of light&#039; hit your object and get projected into those &#039;three components: a reflected ray, a transmitted ray, and a surface plasmon.&#039; How should I understand that?

As if each photon &#039;wavepacket&#039; interacting, in its &#039;mediation&#039; get split up into three components, superimposed too? And if they do, is that the way I can expect all light to act when &#039;interacting&#039;? 

As I said, it&#039;s a weird question.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A really stupid question, just touching the photons here. When they, your &#8216;ray of light&#8217; hit your object and get projected into those &#8216;three components: a reflected ray, a transmitted ray, and a surface plasmon.&#8217; How should I understand that?</p>
<p>As if each photon &#8216;wavepacket&#8217; interacting, in its &#8216;mediation&#8217; get split up into three components, superimposed too? And if they do, is that the way I can expect all light to act when &#8216;interacting&#8217;? </p>
<p>As I said, it&#8217;s a weird question.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://skullsinthestars.com/2009/07/04/some-musings-on-negative-refraction/#comment-3950</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Bob]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 02:39:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skullsinthestars.com/?p=2114#comment-3950</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The paper &quot;Correct deﬁnition of the Poynting vector in electrically and magnetically
polarizable medium reveals that negative refraction is impossible&quot; by Vadim Markel (from OPEX, I think) may interest you.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The paper &#8220;Correct deﬁnition of the Poynting vector in electrically and magnetically<br />
polarizable medium reveals that negative refraction is impossible&#8221; by Vadim Markel (from OPEX, I think) may interest you.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: IronMonkey</title>
		<link>http://skullsinthestars.com/2009/07/04/some-musings-on-negative-refraction/#comment-3940</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[IronMonkey]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Jul 2009 16:11:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skullsinthestars.com/?p=2114#comment-3940</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Stating that &quot;Any experimenter wishing to demonstrate that they have a true negative index material must therefore do more than simply demonstrate negative refraction&quot; is a fact we often forget. Also, I do not know if anyone has ever demonstrated beyond doubt a true &quot;negative index material&quot;; it seems to me that so far only &quot;negative refraction&quot; has been shown in metamaterials / photonic crystals / metals.

For the case of a hypothetical &quot;negative index material&quot; (NIM), not only does conservation of momentum seems to be problematic (as shown in this post), but the closely-related phenomenon of &quot;time reversal&quot; [J. Pendry, Science 322 (2008)] is no more intuitive. The demonstration using Snell&#039;s law implies that transmitted waves in medium 2 are homogeneous (i.e. not evanescent like plasmons). Thus we can show that Snell&#039;s formalism at the vaccum-NIM interface requires enforcing &quot;negative time&quot; in order to yield a transmitted plane wave with a proper wavefront. 

Furthermore, a recent theoretical investigation points that a NIM would violate the second law of thermodynamics if it existed [V. Markel Optics Express 16 (2008)].

Hence the existence of a &quot;true&quot; NIM still raises a number of fundamental questions IMHO; meanwhile research for negative refraction and related devices is still going strong.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Stating that &#8220;Any experimenter wishing to demonstrate that they have a true negative index material must therefore do more than simply demonstrate negative refraction&#8221; is a fact we often forget. Also, I do not know if anyone has ever demonstrated beyond doubt a true &#8220;negative index material&#8221;; it seems to me that so far only &#8220;negative refraction&#8221; has been shown in metamaterials / photonic crystals / metals.</p>
<p>For the case of a hypothetical &#8220;negative index material&#8221; (NIM), not only does conservation of momentum seems to be problematic (as shown in this post), but the closely-related phenomenon of &#8220;time reversal&#8221; [J. Pendry, Science 322 (2008)] is no more intuitive. The demonstration using Snell&#8217;s law implies that transmitted waves in medium 2 are homogeneous (i.e. not evanescent like plasmons). Thus we can show that Snell&#8217;s formalism at the vaccum-NIM interface requires enforcing &#8220;negative time&#8221; in order to yield a transmitted plane wave with a proper wavefront. </p>
<p>Furthermore, a recent theoretical investigation points that a NIM would violate the second law of thermodynamics if it existed [V. Markel Optics Express 16 (2008)].</p>
<p>Hence the existence of a &#8220;true&#8221; NIM still raises a number of fundamental questions IMHO; meanwhile research for negative refraction and related devices is still going strong.</p>
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